BARRY: It sounds just about like the demo did except it was embellished in the studio. They list a few songs on the front but its basically a big drawing of the Red baron on the cover and a tiny picture of The Royal Guardsmen on the back. JOHN: Phil Gernhard had promised us he would put a regular song out, which he did with Baby Lets Wait. They were that blown away. The audience didnt accept it though because it wasnt what they thought of as The Royal Guardsmen. We did the Summer Shower of Stars tour following that in the summer of 1967 with Sam the Sham and the Pharaohs and Tommy James and the Shondells. The crowd loved it, they thought it was part of the show! I also played this big line of tubular bells with flip flops on! JOHN: When I Needed You was recorded, Chris had all the lights turned down and he made us step off to the side so we werent in his vision. We both went and got hair cuts but we saved our hair and stuffed it in the schools mail box! It didnt go so then he came back and said now you have to do Snoopy. CHRIS: We came up with a list of tracks we wanted to do that had a cartoon theme to them. ET: The Return of the Red Baron is probably your most personal album but neither it nor the single did as well as the first ones. The song had originally been written by Dick Holler as a straight historical ballad, like Johnny Hortons Sink the Bismark, but about the Red Baron. We had already released Baby Lets Wait and Leaving Me so the only thing we had left that we recorded was that. We played Washington State, Oregon, LA, and San Francisco. JOHN: Thats because they had just made us get it cut! ET: How did I Needed You end up on the B-side of Snoopy vs. I was attending the University of Florida at the time, and would come home on the weekends. I had fun with that thing! BILLY: We had started to get some royalty checks by this point and we knew they were going to want a single so we went along with it. We came on stage and started doing all this Procol Harum stuff and they just sat down and didnt move for two hours! I knew what it was but I was afraid to tell them! BILL: We werent too enthusiastic about it in the first place because all Gernhard had told us was to give it three or four chords and a military feel on the drums. We played it for him and he said play it again, I kind of like that. CHRIS: It didnt have all the sound effects and stuff in it but it was pretty close. Charles looked at it but never sent a response on whether we could do this or not. We played the Cow Palace in San Francisco with Jefferson Airplane. I pulled the metal tag off the amplifier and stuck it to the face of the bass drum. They didnt take me because I had a bad elbow and back at the time so I had to wear a wig! BILLY: We did a version of Charlie Brown for that album which was my only chance to be a star vocally. There was a different sound and different tracks you wanted to play. BARRY: It was within a months time frame, literally, from the time we recorded this thing to the time it started to kick. CHRIS: We came up with a list of tracks we wanted to do that had a cartoon theme to them. BARRY: Return was just one of those typical record company things. I got to put in some instruments that they probably wouldnt have used if I hadnt mentioned I would like to do that. After a while, it got to where we would do the Snoopy songs first just to get them out of the way. BILLY: That was done at Six Gun Territory. He put everything into it. He was just a wonderful guy, just warm and personal. He was just a wonderful guy, just warm and personal. ET: Prior to the first album being released, what types of songs did you play in your live shows? I had fun with that thing! I wasnt about to just let them throw me on the ground so I went to enlist and I cut all my hair off, I wasnt going to let them do that either. Most of us were still in high school and couldnt have long hair so they had us wear wigs. We played with the Beach Boys in Seattle. After a while, it got to where we would do the Snoopy songs first just to get them out of the way. Gernhard came out to hear it and we figured he wont like it, hell leave us alone! They released that as a single and Billy and Barry wrote it. They wanted to get something out there and keep it going. We were down there one afternoon setting up the equipment when a guy walked up to us with a yellow legal pad. BILLY: We played a community center in Chicago during our 1968 tour for a bunch of hip kids. BILLY: I think thats what kept us going. It wasnt against each other it was just the whole business. JOHN: When I Needed You was recorded, Chris had all the lights turned down and he made us step off to the side so we werent in his vision. His lawyers smelled money and, whether Charles cared or not, the lawyers put a ding in us! BILL: It was the only thing we had left in the can! We came on stage and started doing all this Procol Harum stuff and they just sat down and didnt move for two hours! ET: How close was this to the final version? I had fun with that thing! The Red Baron? ET: How much input did you have into the tracks that went on the album? I have to tell you, there are those that consider I Needed You to be one of the worst records of all time! ET: Did you play different tracks live than what was on the albums? We were a cover band back in the days before the term caught on. ET: Obviously, there was an official image of The Royal Guardsmen that was sold to the public and there was the true image behind that one that was a different group. BILLY: We played a community center in Chicago during our 1968 tour for a bunch of hip kids. BILL: Get the album done! Were trying to get this song cut and were showing it to a lot of local bands to see who comes up with the best treatment. The others, except for Barry, were all in college at that time. Were you pushing for something else? BILLY: Absolutely, we did Sunshine of Your Love, Purple Haze and lots of Procol Harum. ET: The Return of the Red Baron is probably your most personal album but neither it nor the single did as well as the first ones. I was attending the University of Florida at the time, and would come home on the weekends. Eventually we told him to leave and finished up with the orchestra without him. The A and B sides of that single were clearly intended for two different audiences. JOHN: Of all the songs we did I think that one had the nicest production. We got called into the Principals office one day and were told you cant stay here like that, you have to get a hair cut or well throw you out. He only released it regionally in Florida and it only sold like 2000 copies. It held forty-five thousand people and the stage revolved. BILL: Our first gig was in March of 1965. ET: Being asked to join The Royal Guardsmen was obviously more attractive than starting with a new group like The Griffins. BILLY: That was done at Six Gun Territory. I got to put in some instruments that they probably wouldnt have used if I hadnt mentioned I would like to do that. Most of us were still in high school and couldnt have long hair so they had us wear wigs. BILL: Get the album done! It was booming through the riser I was on. He said hi, my name is Phil Gernhard and Im a record producer. A lot of people were introduced to this single at a young age and when they flipped the record over they were in for a very jarring surprise on the B side. People were blown away with what we were playing. We had people come up to us afterwards and say we came to laugh at the Snoopy boys but you guys can play! I was into the sound effects and finding things to hit that would make neat noises! I think a lot of that has to do with it being a 180 degree departure from Snoopy. It was booming through the riser I was on. Then Christmas of 1967 came around and they wanted us to do Snoopys Christmas which we werent too enthusiastic about but it turned out to be a good move. ET: There could not have been much time between when you recorded the song and when they released it because it was on top of the charts already in November of 1966. When we got the album done and they listed the songs, Charles Schulz asked us not to include that one. The crowd loved it, they thought it was part of the show! We continued to get better and started playing out at Johnsons Beach drawing good crowds. I think thats what really kept us going after the Snoopy hit and the record company beating us with the gimmick stuff. ET: That was at Fuller Studios in Tampa? JOHN: Of all the songs we did I think that one had the nicest production. Even though we had a partition behind us it was still odd. He ratted me out and we got suspended. They test marketed that but it didnt get a really big response. He said hi, my name is Phil Gernhard and Im a record producer. BARRY: We did one show in Seattle at a huge coliseum called The Round. I was into the sound effects and finding things to hit that would make neat noises! I think thats what really kept us going after the Snoopy hit and the record company beating us with the gimmick stuff. We got a pretty good response and so we got asked back the next time they had one of these local band shows. Were you pushing for something else? The band was managed by Leonard Stogel and Associates. I saw this blue-white light just arc as it shorted out on my lip! We had people come up to us afterwards and say we came to laugh at the Snoopy boys but you guys can play! They eventually changed their name to Gingerbread and recorded an album in New York called Flow. The guys in the booth kept going whats that noise? ET: Did you play different tracks live than what was on the albums? He told us that if we would go to Tampa and cut a demo he would shop it around to a few labels and see what happens. CHRIS: Right, smoking in the auditorium! ET: Did you play different tracks live than what was on the albums? My mother thought I was on drugs! He put everything into it. Charles looked at it but never sent a response on whether we could do this or not. BILL: After Snoopys Christmas, the follow up was I Say Love which was an original song. ET: So by June of 1966 the lineup for The Royal Guardsmen was finalized. BILL: Get the album done! I also played this big line of tubular bells with flip flops on! We go Behind the Christmas Earmoth with Barry Winslow of The Royal Guardsmen to talk about their Christmas classic Snoopy's Christmas Bells! We didnt mind doing whatever they came up with from their writers as long as it was more along the lines of what we wanted to do but they pushed Return of the Red Baron on us. Then Larry Rich got his draft notice and decided to join the Navy. Chris had the vocals for the Jagger and Burdon styles and Barry had the vocals for the Beatles. We will now sing together the story of the beloved Red Baron and that pig-headed dog Snoopy! CHRIS: Right, smoking in the auditorium! We played the Cow Palace in San Francisco with Jefferson Airplane. BILLY: I think thats what kept us going. JOHN: When we did the Joey Bishop Show I went to move the boom mic because I didnt sing at that time and I heard a huge voice come out of the sky and say dont touch that! JOHN: Phil Gernhard had promised us he would put a regular song out, which he did with Baby Lets Wait. How did that photo shoot come about? ET: Did Phil Gernhard have permission from Charles Schulz to use Snoopy? I saw this blue-white light just arc as it shorted out on my lip! ED Tucker: How did the Royal Guardsmen get started as a group? CHRIS: We got a good response to the shows. BARRY: We did one show in Seattle at a huge coliseum called The Round. BARRY: It sounds just about like the demo did except it was embellished in the studio. BILL: We didnt want to do any more novelty type tunes. When you went to the University of Florida at that time, you had to take a foreign language. Chris had the vocals for the Jagger and Burdon styles and Barry had the vocals for the Beatles. Tom was the only one in the whole school who had red hair so eventually they figured it was him. I was into the sound effects and finding things to hit that would make neat noises! Ricardo Montalban was the co-host. BILLY: We had started to get some royalty checks by this point and we knew they were going to want a single so we went along with it. We figured nobody was ever going to hear it any way! We were rehearsing the song and I was stomping my base drum foot even though I was not actually hitting the drum. They wanted to get something out there and keep it going. The Red Baron or was the idea to get into the studio and record an album as quickly as possible? CHRIS: It didnt have all the sound effects and stuff in it but it was pretty close. I knew what it was but I was afraid to tell them! I had fun with that thing! We played it for him and he said play it again, I kind of like that. I knew what it was but I was afraid to tell them! We played with the Beach Boys in Seattle. It had Baby Lets Wait on the A side and Leaving Me on the B side because those were the first two songs we recorded. ET: Prior to the first album being released, what types of songs did you play in your live shows? It held forty-five thousand people and the stage revolved. I think thats what really kept us going after the Snoopy hit and the record company beating us with the gimmick stuff. Heres a bunch of garage band kids with an amazing record on their hands and thrust into the world of big rock and roll! BARRY: They went long in Ricardo Montalbans segment and they just threw us in there. Did they still want to continue with the novelty records? We had to chase the mic stands and one of them hit me right in the face! They didnt take me because I had a bad elbow and back at the time so I had to wear a wig! They had great harmony together. They wanted to get something out there and keep it going. They had great harmony together. We had an orchestra conductor who was trying to rewrite the song because it wasnt clinically correct but it doesnt have to be clinically correct to be right! CHRIS: We came up with a list of tracks we wanted to do that had a cartoon theme to them. BARRY: Return was just one of those typical record company things. We played with the Beach Boys in Seattle. BILLY: He had independently contracted with them to give them first refusal The Kingsmen had a hit with Jolly Green Giant and the Sam the Sham had Little Red Riding Hood. 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